Aer Lingus/Aer Arann

[Humberside]

Rumour on pprune (so usual pinch of salt needed) about some Aer Arann ATR's being operated from Aer Lingus mostly on UK routes from March 2010. No airports specifically mentioned but could be ideal for HUY-DUB

Would also be ideal for DSA-DUB, and there was a press article a few months ago that seemed to indicated a possibly Aer Arann DUB service. But maybe still worth hoping for

[elmfield]

I understand that Aer Arran were rebuffed by Peel when they wished to continue with their SCA-DUB service and rumour has it that they are still smarting!

[pug]

Is that true elmfield? I thought they had dropped the route prior to Peel taking over?

Personaly the wayi read the post was that RE would be used on the thinner EI UK routes, i.e freeing up the other aircraft for more profitable operations... Something tells me Aer Arran are not doing so well at the moment so could be some shaky times ahead for them? Hence franchising for Aer Lingus.

[elmfield]

Peel effectively took control with the signing of an "understanding"on 30 July 2001....Aer Arran, BA and Brymon continued flying for some time after that date. but by 2002 the Airports facilities, including fire-fighting and rescue, had been significantly downgraded. As with so much else concerned with the fate of SCA, the facts are not easy to obtain but to describe the affair as a "mystery contained within an enigma" might not be far off the mark!But what is certain were the very strong" noises" coming from SCA that Aer Arrans' overtures had been rejected....which is hardly surprising given the terms of the "understanding".

[Humberside]

We can forget any hope of RE/EI now. Shame, because they were the best chance by a long way of getting DUB back

[pug]

I wouldnt say best chance, its widely known that HUY are keeping a clear path for KLM.

After this i certainly wouldnt rule out DUB restarting from HUY with another operator. I would question the financial well being of RE too, they will get little from the code share agreements.

[Humberside]

Where do KLM come into this?

[pug]

Allowing a code-share operation such as RE to DUB with EI may annoy KLM, i fully believe HUY are keeping the hub operation solely for KLM so not to saturate the market.

[Humberside]

Would KLM really be bothered about another connecting option to just JFK, the only US flight the new DSA-DUB service will connect into (EI don't offer European connections). How many passengers connect HUY-AMS-JFK/EWR a day? 10? 20? Surely it can't be much more than that? And then how many of those would consider switching to EI, especially when frequent flyer loyalty is factored in? I would be shocked if KLM lost anything more than a single digit number of passengers a day to EI

If the airport are that protective, what if Flybe for example proposed a HUY-SOU with connections at SOU to CDG. Or is Air Berlin proposed to start a Palma service with connections to BCN/MAD/LIS. Would the airport say no? OK - none of those are likely but the principle is the same. Is the airport worried T3 offer Stavanger connections. I bet Stavanger is almost as popular as New York from HUY.

I can see the logic in not wanting say Brussels Airlines, but Aer Lingus are hardly going to be a major threat

[pug]

I agree, it would have no negative effect on KLM, but you never can be too careful. Clearly MAG are doing all they can to accomodate KLM, though i dont believe KLM have any reason to leave either.

If airberlin were to want an operation to PMI then i believe that would be different. It would be more likely to appeal to the bucket and spade market.

This is the reason i dont believe we will ever see CPH return, many use KLM to get to scandanavia. Im sure they would work side by side but would it be worth it to cannibilise their loads?

[elmfield]

Are Yorkshire Forward subsidising the DSA/DUB route?

[Humberside]

The AB/PMI example probably wasn't the best since any connections would indeed be a different market to KLM. But it does show how many potential new service options may include a small element of connecting traffic. Be it a regional airline, or some LoCo's

Jan 26, 2010 16:34:24 GMT pug said:

This is the reason i dont believe we will ever see CPH return, many use KLM to get to scandanavia. Im sure they would work side by side but would it be worth it to cannibilise their loads?

Scandinavia is obviously a major connecting market out of HUY, but again, where do you draw the line? You've already got Eastern offering Stavanger and Bergen connections, and for a time Oslo too.

KLM need protecting to an extent, but protect them too much and growth options become very limited. IMO, there needs to be an acceptance that on a few limited routes they may be non-stop competition. And while it might irritate KLM, that will probably be it. They've faced up to these challenges at many many other airports, so I'm sure they would at HUY too. And it's not like they would see no competition at DSA, so I'm not sure how the 'moving' arguement could be brought in here. Would they really 'throw a paddy' just because there is a new connecting option to one or two other cities?

Interestingly the masterplan, for what it is now worth, did mention Stockholm Skvasta as a potential destination.

[pug]

Thats a fair point, though i suspect growth in that respect is limited, it coud affect KLM with people already connecting via AMS to get there. I suspect they might be talking with FR to try to get those type of routes, though its unlikely FR will ever come back with big bases at EMA and LBA.

I think the main growing point now is to try to get a based operator of some sort to fly the destinations which have been lost over the years, whilst also keeping hold of KLM. If the shipping increases significantly like has been rumoured then i believe that will help bring in more airlines.

The announcement of BE is a step in the right direction, if its successful then i suspect more will be added for 2011. Still hopefuly Jet2 might decide to base here yet...

[Humberside]

Jet 2 have to be the best and most realistic option for future significant growth